BLUEMOMENT

Google Maps seem to have mispelled Loch Iubhair (loch of the yew tree), near Crianlarich, as " Loch Lubhair" (loch of the windae shutters, perhaps?). It doesn't seem to be possible to contact them about the error, which probably helps to explain why Google now list over a thousand links to the loch with the incorrect spelling.

A minor issue perhaps, but what with the medium being the message and stuff, Google has got enormous power to make facts, and change truth into fiction. Unlike organisations like Wikipedia and Geograph, Google doesn't seem to encourage having its errors corrected.

Has Google become too big for its boots?

It's free. If you dont like it then dont use it.

bosun higgs wrote:It's free. .........

don`t quite think that was the point being made, old chap

Absolute Outrage - Shard, do something

claymore wrote:do something

Good point, and by raising the issue, I have. Their web crawler picks these up and adds them to their Google web listings, which all adds pressure on them. There is an Google Map "Edit" facility, but only, I believe, in the US. It is not presently available in the UK and other countries.

Bosun, nothing is free, and we all indirectly subsidise high volume providers like Google and its YouTube through the costs of telecommunications infrastructure contruction being passed on to consumers through our telephone bills. Google is a prime source for basic map information nowadays; the content (which is supplied by Google, and not by users) should be of quality, and should encourage users to correct errors when spotted.

Shard wrote:
Has Google become too big for its boots?

It came as a bit of a shock to the planet when we realised that 90% of ALL transactions taking place - financial. personal etc etc - were via an operating system distributed and controlled by one corporation - Microsoft. We all love to hate Windows and Microsoft but really Gates has turned out to be one of the good guys - he did not hold the world to ransom Blofeld-style and has spent a large precentage of his billions on worthy causes. We were lucky there . . . but Google is every bit as much of a potential threat to our personal freedom, and maybe more so.

As Google are now head and shoulders above any other search providers we are now in the position where Google is if not the sole gateway then the main access route to all human knowledge. Being 'good at Google' is one of the greatest skills you can have nowadays, whether as a researcher, web developer or private individual. With Linux making increasing inroads into the desktop market worldwide Microsoft's star is waning, but Google's is now blazing at the zenith. With this power comes enormous social responsibility.

As the man said, it aint free and Google are no longer driven by primarily philanthropic motives. They should and must be held to account. To me Google Books and Google Street are both potentially worrying developments, indicating possible megalomaniac tendencies. Let us be thankful that we have Shard to rein them in. Go Shard!

Nick wrote:It came as a bit of a shock to the planet when we realised that 90% of ALL transactions taking place - financial. personal etc etc - were via an operating system distributed and controlled by one corporation - Microsoft. We all love to hate Windows and Microsoft but really Gates has turned out to be one of the good guys - he did not hold the world to ransom Blofeld-style and has spent a large precentage of his billions on worthy causes. We were lucky there . . .

Interesting perspective and, reflecting on it, absolutely true. Thanks for the new insight.

Nick wrote:Google is if not the sole gateway then the main access route to all human knowledge.

jings, read a book ... quick ... the mobile library van turns up on a Monday at 12

These internet geezers can lose money like nobody else; Time-Warner lost one fortune buying AOL and AOL lost another fortune buying beebo. Only a matter of time afore Google/YouTube carry this splendid tradition on?

ParaHandy wrote:

Nick wrote:Google is if not the sole gateway then the main access route to all human knowledge.

jings, read a book ... quick ... the mobile library van turns up on a Monday at 12

Too late - I'll have to wait until next Monday now.

Oh sod it, I'll just use Google.

To support your error finding, Shard, I recently typed in a London office postcode as I didn't have a clue where my meeting the following morning was. Google Maps displayed the location but I felt a little suspicious (not the right part of town, you know). So I asked the other 2 people who unfortunate enough to be sitting near me to try the postcode in Google Maps. Same result - wrong location. And before you ask, correct postcode! Over a mile out. And the address was that of a very large, well-known firm. Odd, eh?

They're all out to get us...

To return to the OP for a moment, I believe the brown tourist info road sign was itself misspelt Loch Lubhair for a number of years.

Silkie wrote:I believe the brown tourist info road sign was itself misspelt Loch Lubhair for a number of years.

Could be, but don't recall that. Our climbing club hut, Ochils MC's Inverardran Cottage, is just along the road towards Crianlarich, and I only ever knew the loch as Iubhair with an "I". I think that someone at Google has misread an Ordnance Survey sans-serif "I" as an "L".

I appreciate that you were restricting your comment to the name of that loch, but recognise that you are probably also concerned about the broader issue. To be honest the particular issue of the loch's name is pretty trivial, but there is a much bigger picture that Nick very clearly illustrated. Google has a social responsibility to ensure that Google-generated content is accurate; allowing user input (as in the US, and, apparently, in Australia and NZ) to make them aware of errors would improve the accuracy of their content, and help prevent the spread of misinformation.

The accuracy and provenance of online "factual" information is already becoming a problem, which will proliferate if not addressed.

This thread reminds me of a related issue, and that is the replacement of English language place names on Admiralty charts by Gaelic ones alone. A policy adopted for no better reason according to the UKHO than the Ordnance survey having done the same thing.

Might sound like a good idea to the Scots Nats but to the rest of the world it isnt. The Gaelic names are unpronounceable to a non native and that matters in an emergency.

I dont have any up to date Scottish charts so I dont know whether the HO followed through on the plan they explained to use. Did they?

And as a comment on the Google issue, have you not thought that many words are spelled differently in the USA and this may simply be an American version of the name.

bosun higgs wrote:This thread reminds me of a related issue, and that is the replacement of English language place names on Admiralty charts by Gaelic ones alone.

This is an issue fresh in my mind. It seems to me there is a general "problem" with consistent naming and spelling of places in Scotland.

A good example from last week - I assume the anchorage at Port Lunna/Port Lunni is referred to in old CCC guides only as Biggar's Gut. CMAP used a different spelling of Lunna. The OS uses Port Lunni, I think. I still don't know for sure if we really went to Biggar's Gut or not!

Personally, I like the concept of having several different names and pronunciations for places. Adds to the mystery. Also, I far prefer Gaelic names even though I've got no hope of pronouncing them. (I found out last week that Gigha is said "Geehar" rather than "Jigar" and Tayvallich effectively ends in a K. Mhore says 'Vore'?). You can guess how I used to pronounce Croabh.

I agree that in an emergency situation this could all be problematic but it's still good fun. To put the problem in to perspective In Greece I can't pronounce anything or speak a word of the language so 99 per cent of the time simply couldn't give my position to a local at all. Gaelic names are a minor problem in comparison. (Especially since anyone local will be as familiar with the mispronunciations as the correct.)

Adopting a consistent Anglicized names would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Long may confusion reign.