Raising the Nancy Glen

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Nick
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Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby Nick » Fri Jan 26, 2018 3:10 pm

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"FORMER First Minister Alex Salmond has called on the UK Government to pay for the raising of the Nancy Glen fishing boat which sank in Loch Fyne, with the bodies of missing fishermen Duncan MacDougall and Przemek Krawczyk thought to be on board.

The Clyde Fishermen’s Association and the men’s families have started fundraising campaigns to salvage the boat so that the two men can be buried ashore, with almost £150,000 raised in just a few days.

In 1987, Salmond fronted the campaign which raised £600,000 to lift the wreck of the Peterhead-based Sapphire trawler which had the bodies of four crewmen on board.

He told The National: “Twenty years ago the families in Peterhead went through all of this and eventually had to raise the boat themselves.

“There are a number of precedents for boats to be raised when they are in shallow or inland waters and the Marine Accident Investigation Branch should step forward and say it will raise the Nancy Glen.

“It is unacceptable in terms of humanity that fishermen should be left aboard sunken vessels within eyesight of the shore. It is totally unacceptable in terms of common humanity and it should be a public responsibility for the men to be recovered and given a proper burial.”
- Nick 8)

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claymore
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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby claymore » Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:41 pm

Struggling to understand how a sunken vessel can be seen from the shore....
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BlowingOldBoots
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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby BlowingOldBoots » Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:04 pm

Weird! updated post and it duplicated it. Deleted the duplicate
Last edited by BlowingOldBoots on Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby BlowingOldBoots » Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:10 pm

The wreck of Nancy Glen is lying at a depth of over 140m (460 feet). That is a tough call to raise a wreck. Salmond once again gets it wrong and turns it into a political point scoring contest by "calling" on the UK Government to fund the salvage. The Scottish Government should fund an attempt as an act of goodwill but it sets a precedent; who is worthy of government assistance.

There is a debate, that will not likely be heard, that the money would best be spent on other causes and can be put to better use, the search for Scotlands missing children, support for poverty, victims of abuse. There are also other lost sailors in Scotland, the crew of the Cemfiord probably went down with the ship which is in 75m of water, no calls to recover them.

There is an argument that recovery of the wreck will allow lessons to be learned but I do not believe that any lessons will be effectively implemented. Professional seafarers can be very unprofessional when costs that erode profit have to be realised, especially when margins are small.

Personally, I think there should be an effort to recover the bodies but it should apply to all, including the crew of the Cemfiord, who equally deserve to be laid to rest, rather than the wreck being declared a grave site. I suspect that the grubby hand of politics, rather than altruism is at play here. There is a tradition and history of accepting that the sea is the grave of lost sailors.

The wreck of the Sapphire was found in 90m of water.
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Gordonmc
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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby Gordonmc » Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:22 pm

Having spent the days before the loss of Nancy Glen with friends in Tarbert I have a different perspective than that of B.O.B.
It is only natural that the families of the two lost men as well as the wider community want recovery of the bodies for proper funerals and that in itself justifies the calls for the wreck to recovered, in my opinion.
However, the lack of an explanation of what happened to cause the capsize makes the argument for recovery even more pressing.
There is precedent. When the Solway Harvester was lost recovery of the wreck was funded by the government of the Isle of Man. Subsequent examination found evidence which led to a prosecution and despite the failure of the court action, lessons were learned.
Similarly when the Antares sank in the Arran Trench it was only after the wreck was raised that it was confirmed her nets had been caught by the submarine Trenchant. As a result rules of operations for submarine in the vicinity of commercial vessels were changed and the SUBFAX scheme was introduced. Antares was raised from a depth of 150 metres.
The Mhairi-L was lost in the Irish Sea. The wreck was found but never recovered. The possible cause of the tragedy, her nets being caught on a seabed BT cable, remains speculation.

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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby Aja » Tue Feb 27, 2018 3:23 pm

I'm not sure what the families have been told to expect. If / when the Nancy Glen is raised there wont be much left of the bodies - it being a prawn boat and there being prawns in the hold.

Donald

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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby SteveN » Thu Apr 12, 2018 6:53 pm

Job done then. Personally I think it's the right thing to do for a wreck in inshore waters. What a grim job for someone though.

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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby BlowingOldBoots » Fri Jun 01, 2018 12:03 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-g ... t-44322253

The SNP government actions have probably made the situation a lot worse for this family: -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-g ... t-44322253

The inconsistency is what is pathetic, who gets to decide that a boat should be lifted or not and based on what criteria?
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wully
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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby wully » Fri Jun 01, 2018 8:24 pm

BlowingOldBoots wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-44322253

The SNP government actions have probably made the situation a lot worse for this family: -

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-g ... t-44322253

The inconsistency is what is pathetic, who gets to decide that a boat should be lifted or not and based on what criteria?


What would you have done if it had been your decision to make? Lift one or none?

(Had it been my decision I’d have left them be - as would be my wish If was me dead at the bottom of the sea)

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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby BlowingOldBoots » Sat Jun 02, 2018 11:41 am

Gut feeling is that I would leave the bodies in the deep unless there is a reason to suspect criminal activity in which case, depending on an investigation into backgrounds and suspicion, a call to raise could be made.

It is a genuinely difficult decision because most of these boats are supposed to have a degree of safety that reduces the probability of a sinking. Maybe the answer sits with greater inspection of the fishing community, not more regulation, more oversight that actually orders fishermen who have less robust practises to sort out their mess. Maybe the fishermen themselves need to be educated about risk normalisation and the folly of being comfortable with out of date safety equipment and unsafe practises.

Thankfully it is very rare but maybe that rarity is also supports by default, that governments should raise the vessels and insurance should be mandatory for the recovery.

It is a gross injustice that one set of families have government support for funds to recover the vessel, but another does not. So far I don't think the SNP have explained why they cant intervene in every case.
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wully
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Re: Raising the Nancy Glen

Postby wully » Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:57 pm

BlowingOldBoots wrote: So far I don't think the SNP have explained why they cant intervene in every case.


Money.....


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