Survey for insurance purposes

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ParaHandy
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Survey for insurance purposes

Postby ParaHandy » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:11 am

I've been asked by the insurer to do a full out of water survey and I'm beginning to wonder what sort of mug am I for agreeing to it. I should have smelt a rat when the survey asked if I minded the bastardio gouging bits out the hull for osmosis testing, I presume. My boat's not insured for osmosis and I've yet to hear of a boat sinking because of it. I should just have dumped the insurer and got another one? Would that count as having been refused insurance I wonder?

Anyway, it's pishing with rain today and tomorrow. Whenever she feels grumpy, it's generally the top tricolour light that fails and I'm fekked if I'm going down to the yard and up the mast in the fekkin pouring rain to fix it if it is bust, and, the survey is on Monday.

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claymore
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby claymore » Sun Mar 02, 2014 9:19 am

Why wid they want the lights oan in broad daylight - is the fekker a Dane? :shake:

In answer to your question, technically you have been offered a continuation of your insurance with the condition that you have a survey carried out.
Its therefore your prerogative to seek another provider - you could be doing that in pursuit of a more competitive quote.
If you have 'no claims discount' I'm not sure another company would offer to take that on unless a survey had been carried out.
A light not working is not a reason to fail and if ye got yer short arms intae yer deep pockets an got the yard tae hoik someone up there tae fix the fekker - yer dilemma is over.
All that aside - yer lookin older these days sae Passing Wind mae well soon be oan ra market - a recent survey wid help ye offload it ontae some puir unsuspectin fekker.
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Claymore
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ParaHandy
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby ParaHandy » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:00 pm

claymore wrote:All that aside - yer lookin older these days sae Passing Wind mae well soon be oan ra market - a recent survey wid help ye offload it ontae some puir unsuspectin fekker.

When wus the last time youse wus asked tae produce yer seniors rail card by ra ticket inspector? Eh?

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claymore
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby claymore » Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:28 pm

3 weeks ago an SHE said "c'mon sonny, this cannae be yours"
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Claymore
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ParaHandy
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby ParaHandy » Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:22 am

It's disgraceful that those who can afford tae own a boat need tae huv their travel subsidised by the rest of us.

Well, the navigation lights all worked but the wee chap said he wassnae interested as they might no work the next day, blimey. Sadly, despite ma best efforts, I forgot aboot the flares which were well out of date. The things were virtually hidden which is why they were forgotten.

He was sat in the saloon extolling the virtues of ma boat, note not how well maintained it is or wus that implied?, when I saw a big drip about to fall on him from the roof. It did. A new effing leak. I'm not alone in finding ma boat leaking, apparently, others report so much rain has fallen that it's finding its way in. The 2 leaks might have been found and sealed or caulked or superglued. It better not leak ony more, is all I'll say.

Then there's the rigging. "Over 10 years is it, well, I recommend it be inspected" that is going to be expensive (whoever inspects it is never going to risk saying 20 year old rigging is fine, are they?) but I don't know whether the insurer will demand it be replaced before re insuring her or they'll ask the recommendations be followed and, in the meantime, if the mast falls down without new rigging, yer on yer own?

Then there's a gas safe certificate ....

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ParaHandy
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby ParaHandy » Thu Mar 06, 2014 10:35 am

ParaHandy wrote:Then there's the rigging. "Over 10 years is it, well, I recommend it be inspected" that is going to be expensive (whoever inspects it is never going to risk saying 20 year old rigging is fine, are they?) but I don't know whether the insurer will demand it be replaced before re insuring her or they'll ask the recommendations be followed and, in the meantime, if the mast falls down without new rigging, yer on yer own?

I've decided to take the surveyor on. When I feel I'm being screwed over eg car parking sharks, I get cross.

The statement in his report that I object to is this "it is known that 1/19 standing rigging should be replaced every ten years". This is leading the reader to one conclusion only. The Bermudan rigged boat has 10 stays, all of which are 8mm and I've never heard of a Tradewind 35 lose its mast.

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claymore
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby claymore » Thu Mar 06, 2014 1:53 pm

Can anyone join in this monologue?
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Claymore
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ParaHandy
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby ParaHandy » Thu Mar 06, 2014 5:43 pm

You remember when your gas hot water system was condemned? You were offered help and advice?

For my gas system (6ft of pipe from the bottle to the cooker) he's recommended I get gas certification by a gas safe agent *annually*. He recognizes that his recommendation is not required by any statute or law. The yop, though, reading this at insurance HQ will ask for all recommendations be done, period, and if her gas blew up and totaled the boat without a gas certificate less than a year old, that's tough for me. And, the piece of rubber flexible pipe from the copper pipe to the cooker has to be replaced and certified before use. No such advice was offered by the chandlery who sold it.

As far as the rigging is concerned, he was unmoved. The YDSA say that's the case. When asked to produce evidence that my rig (or anyone else's) will collapse after 10 years, he couldn't. He did, subsequently, offer that JOG racing boats replaced their rigging after 5 years. I snorted in derision and that was that.

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claymore
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby claymore » Fri Mar 07, 2014 8:39 am

My rigging was replaced when it was probably around 25 years old
para you seem to be getting cornered by these fekkers - are they in cahoots?
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mm5aho
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby mm5aho » Fri Mar 07, 2014 8:55 am

I've unintentionally tested used standing rigging.
Replacing the stays and shrouds on Contender about 3-4 years ago, (insurance as above) I cold not face just throwing these nice stainless items away, so I put them in my shed, along with the huge pile of other stuff I can't bear to dump, thinking that they might come in handy one day.
I have used them since in some tree felling.
In once case, using large shackles and being careful not to crease the wires, I attached a couple to a large limb that i though could break away and the other end to the tractor.
Driving away from the tree, to take up the tension. I then put some pressure on in low gear, but the tree would not budge. Drive back a bit and get a run up. Still nothing.
So, brute force: back up to the tree and get some speed up....
Stopped the tractor dead! Tree still standing.
(by this time it was becoming obvious that the tree didnt pose the threat of falling down that I'd thought, but because it had resisted me so successfully, I though such a stubborn tree ought to come down anyway, so chainsaw out... but I digress...)

The stay was able to take this shock load of a tractor in 2nd gear, and this is the same device that was replaced only because it was 10 years old.
So I blame the insurance company for that tree's demise.
Geoff.
"Contender" Rival 32: Roseneath this winter, Gourock in summer.

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sahona
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby sahona » Fri Mar 07, 2014 3:36 pm

For what it's worth, does anyone take account of over sized rigging possibly lasting longer?
The last 3 boats I've had, have been rigged like Kirk o' Shotts aerial. >30 years old, and one in particular raced by a bunch of bears in a previous life. No sign of trouble.
Possibly these modern rigs with less aluminium and thinner (but more) wires are more susceptible to sudden failure?
I note that later editions of my boat have more slender appendages, so the trend may have started in the '80s.
Anyway, old and a bit thick seems to be a sensible solution (- suits me), and I've never been asked by my insurer to fix anything that isn't broken.
http://trooncruisingclub.org/ 20' - 30' Berths available, Clyde.
Cruising, racing, maintenance facilities. Go take a look, you know you want to.

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claymore
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby claymore » Fri Mar 07, 2014 7:12 pm

My Rigger - that sounds rather grand, says its fine putting on thicker wire but the strength of the whole shooting match is determined by the size of the pin in the connection between shroud and chainplate.....
So its buggerall use putting 10mm wire up and fastening it with a 6mm shackle. My Rigger - it really does sound grand - also says that you would be amazed at how often this piece of daftness can be found
Not on Claymore though :shake:
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Claymore
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Pilgrim
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby Pilgrim » Fri Mar 07, 2014 7:36 pm

For what it is worth, the requirement for changing standing rigging after 10 years seem to be unique to Uk insurers. We bought a Contessa 32 from Holland a few years ago, and everyone was amazed when we had to have the standing rigging that was 11 years old replaced before we sailed the boat back to the UK (otherwise our rig would have been uninsured). The common practice in Holland, according to one of the largest Hallberg Rassy dealers in Europe was not to worry until the rig was 20 years old.

Maybe the salt water in seas around Britain is more corrosive....or maybe there are other interests at work.

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wully
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby wully » Mon Mar 10, 2014 1:47 pm

Those Yott surveyors have no formal training and you only get the letters after yer name if you pay for it. It's a racket...

Get yersel a nice fancy bit o paper made up with some farty yotty surveyor type company name on it, give yer fine shup a clean bill of health and send it off while we still have a decent postal service.

Job done.

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claymore
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Re: Survey for insurance purposes

Postby claymore » Wed Mar 12, 2014 3:58 pm

Para
Widye like masel and the webmeister tae knock ye something together?
Yer fine shup is a Trappedwind 30 odd. Whit value wid ye reckon, fae the photies shelooks fine - yeshould get 11k oan a guid day.
Sae, let me know an then we can settle ra fee afore we send ye a grand sustificate.
Sincerely
Webster &Claymore
A.k.a Rhino Yacht Surveys.
Thick skinned and charges plenty.
Regards
Claymore
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