Nationalise the RNLI?

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Windfinder
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Nationalise the RNLI?

Postby Windfinder » Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:28 pm

Let's have a heated debate.

People seem to frequently complain that the RNLI is not state funded.

It occurs to me this is fairly easy to resolve. The RNLI has a massive surplus of cash so Gordon could take it into state ownership, pocket a large wedge of cash to use for invading third world countries or whatever his bag is at the moment, and nobody could ever complain that we don't have a state funded seabourne rescue service.

Good idea? Bad idea?

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Nick
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Eh?

Postby Nick » Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:41 pm

.
People seem to frequently complain that the RNLI is not state funded.

What people? I've never heard anyone say that . . .
- Nick 8)

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Windfinder
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Re: Eh?

Postby Windfinder » Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:47 pm

Nick wrote:.
People seem to frequently complain that the RNLI is not state funded.

What people? I've never heard anyone say that . . .


Excellent, this topic is even more controversial than I thought!

:D

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Olivepage
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Postby Olivepage » Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:48 pm

OK

I'm game for a fight

It would be the worst possible idea

Everything Cyclops has touched has turned to excrement

This government are incapable of running anything properly.

Even their own party is effectively bankrupt.

Applying the cold dead hand of government to lifeboats would result in a quagmire of rules and regulations making their role almost impossible.

They would then be subject to budget cuts to fund the burocrat for every crewman - like the army has.

There would have to be a tax on boatowners to fund the multi-million pound computer system that would never work.

Inevitably since lifeboats don't fit into any existing ministry, and there would be a battle between MOD Navy and HM Coastguards about ownership, there would have to be a minister for lifeboats and his band of 30,000 civil servants to manage the civil servants who manage the lifeboat men.

There how's that for the opening salvo.

Its back to the bunker for me

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Nick
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Why?

Postby Nick » Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:51 pm

.
Why on earth would anyone want to nationalise them? They are the richest charity in the UK and doing just fine.

Perhaps we should get the RNLI to take over a few other things.
- Nick 8)

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Windfinder
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Re: Nationalise the RNLI?

Postby Windfinder » Sun Jun 29, 2008 10:12 pm

The case for state funding would be: 'The state pay for mountain rescue and and air sea rescue, so why not sea-sea rescue?'.

All we need now is for someone to come along and make it, otherwise the thread's going to fizzle out!

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Olivepage
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Postby Olivepage » Sun Jun 29, 2008 10:47 pm

OK

The state fund air sea rescue as a support service to the military. I still vaguely remember the RAF launches operating out of Bridlington to fish the Lightning pilots out of the wet and salty when they ran out of gas.

They were replaced by helicopters

Since we no longer fly so much stuff out over the sea and since they don't crash as often, fishing soggy yachties out of the 'oggin is the best training they can get. Even if yachties didn't exist there would still be a need for rescue helicopters for the military.

I thought mountain rescue teams were volunteers who were charitably funded. I know the RAF have a mountain rescue unit but like the helicopters they would exist anyway to rescue expensive pilots who bale out in inhospitable areas.

No

The idea is definitely a non starter - and as Nick says there really is no need - if it aint broke - don't fix it.

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ParaHandy
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Re: Why?

Postby ParaHandy » Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:37 am

Nick wrote:.They are the richest charity in the UK and doing just fine.

the only comment abt windy's post is that the funding of the RNLI is not that secure. It costs £100m annually to run and the last stockmarket collapse (1999 to 2003) hit it hard as its assets to annual running costs got close to parity and there's some clause in their Deed (or a requirement from the Charity Commissioners) which require the RNLI to have greater reserves than that. Current stockmarket is lower than 1999 (but not as low as it got 2 yrs later) and there's a dearth of spare cash the noo and legacies.

Ridiculously, it was the Charity Commissioners who forced the RNLI to reduce their reserve (in late 90's?). They were substantial, then ...

Anyway, their position is OK but I wouldn't say its "fine". They can't relax otherwise .. erm ... oops

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Postby magdar » Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:55 am

Dont even think about state involvement in our lifeboats. The red tape would degrade and dilute the service.
Most mountain rescue is carried out by self funded volunteer organisations and Government funded SAR services are suffering from cuts. Rescue 177 based at Prestwick have three cabs but usually only one crew on station. The yougest of the three Seakings is now over 30 years old. I am told that service and training budgets have also been slashed.

I think this is a fair indication of what would become our lifeboats given Government involvment.

Magdar

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Re: Why?

Postby DaveS » Mon Jun 30, 2008 3:48 pm

Nick wrote:.
Perhaps we should get the RNLI to take over a few other things.


They're sort of doing that themselves, with lifeboats now on the Thames and the Caley Canal, and RNLI beach lifeguards. Each new activity is justified as a very small extension of their role, but who knows where it will end? RNLI swimming pool attendants? RNLI narrow boats?

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Re: Why?

Postby Windfinder » Mon Jun 30, 2008 7:03 pm

ParaHandy wrote:
Nick wrote:.They are the richest charity in the UK and doing just fine.

the only comment abt windy's post is that the funding of the RNLI is not that secure.


Surely if the RNLI funding were less than secure that would be an argument *for* making them state funded?

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Postby sahona » Mon Jun 30, 2008 9:04 pm

Natoinalise the RNLI - yes and put them incharge of running the budget. If they're doing well, they should be given a "quango-ship" and allowed to run the (eg) NHS. As for rescue 177, and the SeaKings - did we not have posts on this very forum of the new replacements arriving in a giant russian plane?
http://trooncruisingclub.org/ 20' - 30' Berths available, Clyde.
Cruising, racing, maintenance facilities. Go take a look, you know you want to.

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ParaHandy
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Re: Why?

Postby ParaHandy » Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:18 pm

Windfinder wrote:Surely if the RNLI funding were less than secure that would be an argument *for* making them state funded?

your initial post might have left the impression that the RNLI launches its boats down a slip strewn with fivers; a mistaken impression which i thought could do with correction ...

Windfinder
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Re: Why?

Postby Windfinder » Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:34 pm

ParaHandy wrote:
Windfinder wrote:Surely if the RNLI funding were less than secure that would be an argument *for* making them state funded?

your initial post might have left the impression that the RNLI launches its boats down a slip strewn with fivers; a mistaken impression which i thought could do with correction ...


Well frankly everything I've seen suggests the RNLI is financially pretty stable. Certainly not in a position where the government should be getting involved:

http://www.intelligentgiving.com/charity/209603

Julian

Postby Julian » Tue Jul 01, 2008 2:36 pm

magdar wrote:Dont even think about state involvement in our lifeboats. The red tape would degrade and dilute the service.
Most mountain rescue is carried out by self funded volunteer organisations and Government funded SAR services are suffering from cuts. Rescue 177 based at Prestwick have three cabs but usually only one crew on station. The yougest of the three Seakings is now over 30 years old. I am told that service and training budgets have also been slashed.

I think this is a fair indication of what would become our lifeboats given Government involvment.

Magdar


I do hope when your house has turned into the largest bbq in the UK you turn away the retained firemen as they are diluted and rubbish.


I hope disagreeing with the forum zeitgeist does not bar me from flying a bluemoment burgee, I know we are meant to agree on everything, sorry. :lol:


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